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jonsberndt
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Layout Rules
Oct 20th, 2008 at 2:27am
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Greetings,

I'd really like to see some more thorough discussion of how Layouts are used (FlowLayoutRules, etc.). It was not easy to see all that could be done through the use of layout rules. I could not find any documentation for the LayoutTraits, either.

I have some settings for Nodes that seem to be getting ignored by the FlowLayout class. For example, When I draw links between nodes, the input links all connect to the nodes at one point on the left side of the node, and leave at one point on the right side of the node. I can't recall which property controls that. Anyhow, when I do a FlowLayout->Arrange(), input links to a node are still on the left side, but connect at various points on the left side of the box, instead of just at the middle of the left side. I don't understand how to control that.

Thanks,

Jon
  
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Stoyo
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Re: Layout Rules
Reply #1 - Oct 20th, 2008 at 12:42pm
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Hi,

With most of the layout classes you can use their Anchoring property to control that, but we haven't implemented it yet for FlowLayout. Anyway, after applying a layout, you could set for each link the positions of its first/last points (in DiagramLink.ControlPoints) to align them to the center of some side of the related nodes.

Stoyan
  
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tom_w
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Re: Layout Rules
Reply #2 - Oct 20th, 2008 at 4:43pm
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Hi there

I'd just like to second this request: we are writing a system for a client and intend to use the mindfusion controls for as part of the system. At present I am evaluating the control to see if it works as we need it to.

I have spent the last four days taking the ProcessLayout example to pieces and really trying to understand how it works. The FlowChart.Net control is hugely impressive in its scope and features, but some of the documentation is lacking or just plain missing!

Could you guys write some really in depth tutorials on how layouts work and how to write custom ones?

Some in depth tutorials on how the routing options and routing costs work would also be very useful, and also on the interaction between routing and layouts.

Many thanks Smiley

Tom
  
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tom_w
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Re: Layout Rules
Reply #3 - Oct 20th, 2008 at 4:45pm
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Forgot why I started that post  Embarrassed..

I could really do with the Anchoring property on the FlowchartLayout too.. any idea when/if it will be implemented?

Thanks

Tom
  
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Stoyo
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Re: Layout Rules
Reply #4 - Oct 21st, 2008 at 9:43am
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Hi,

To clarify things a bit, FlowLayout is still under heavy development. We are implementing it according to the specification of a customer (http://www.amadee.de/), and right now its main purpose is to work well with their system of layout rules (which we may not disclose). Its final version will be available in January 2009, and that's when we'll document it in more details and try to provide better samples. Now only our developers that work on Flowlayout know enough about it, but they will check your other posts will hopefully provide solutions to your problems. Not sure if that will fit into the 3 weeks deadline though Undecided

Stoyan
  
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Re: Layout Rules
Reply #5 - Oct 21st, 2008 at 2:00pm
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Oh that is bad news Cry

Thanks for filling me in Stoyan, that explains a lot.

That leaves me with a dilemma:  the FlowChart.net control is the only one I have found that deals with lanes and in theory it does exactly what we need. 

Looking at Amadee's system this isn't suprising as although the software we are writing does a different think to Amadee's, it is also based on the ideas of Activites/Tasks inside business processes.

I'd like to go with the MindFusion solution, but if our issues are realistically going to only be addressed after Amadee's, or if they do not conflict with Amadee's requirements then this will clearly be a problem for us (especially considering the deadline for our project!).

Just to be clear, none of this is a criticism of you guys; it makes perfect sense for you guys to work with one company first to get the first version of the flowlayout sorted and I really appreciate you explaining the situation.  Many companyies would have said 'we'll deal with it' and then not done so.

So, in short, do you have enough developers to help us to, or should we look for a different solution - or consider implementing a different/custom layout instead?

Thanks in advance,

Tom
  
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tom_w
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Re: Layout Rules
Reply #6 - Oct 21st, 2008 at 2:12pm
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Just adding to the above, is it possible for you to tell me what the internal node/group positioning logic of the FlowLayout is and how lanes affect the logic? 

We may be able to work round any bits of the logic that don't work for us if we know what the logic is.

Alternatively, presumably the logic is in the sourcecode? 

If so, are we allowed to alter this if we purchase the sourcecode (I haven't read the license yet).  I'm guessing it will be quicker for us to create a custom layout using the existing FlowLayout as a starting point?
  
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Stoyo
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Re: Layout Rules
Reply #7 - Oct 21st, 2008 at 2:38pm
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Well, in theory it should work with any kinds of rules you define, but we don't know yet how well this works in practice Smiley We are working under contract and deadline on the layout, so we can't make any big changes to it right now, but can implement some small features such as aligning all groups to the left instead of stepping them.

Stoyan
  
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Stoyo
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Re: Layout Rules
Reply #8 - Oct 21st, 2008 at 3:15pm
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I'll try to give you more info on the layout logic tomorrow. Yes, the license lets you modify the source code and distribute custom builds of the Flowchart.NET assemblies with your application.

Stoyan
  
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Re: Layout Rules
Reply #9 - Oct 21st, 2008 at 4:11pm
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Quote:
Well, in theory it should work with any kinds of rules you define, but we don't know yet how well this works in practice Smiley

Grin understood!

Quote:
We are working under contract and deadline

Know the feeling!!

Quote:
can implement some small features such as aligning all groups to the left instead of stepping them.

Great stuff, if you guys can get the sub groups aligning left and cure the layout hanging bug then I reckon we can take care of the rest once we understand the logic the flowlayout is using.

Many thanks for all your help so far,

Tom
  
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Stoyo
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Re: Layout Rules
Reply #10 - Oct 22nd, 2008 at 7:56am
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As for how nodes are arranged in a group, and how groups are positioned relatively to each other -

For each group of nodes, the arrange method builds a horizontal control-flow sequence of nodes, starting from the start node and extending to the end node. For example this could represent a sequence of activity nodes in a sub-process. For other nodes that can be reached from nodes in the control flow line, you can add rules that specify whether the nodes should be displayed below or above the nodes in the control-flow. Such nodes could represent documents, remarks, etc related to an activity node.

How groups are arranged relatively to each other depends on whether their nodes are assigned to the same lanes. FlowLayout tries to keep them aligned horizontally or vertically when possible.

I hope that helps,
Stoyan
  
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tom_w
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Re: Layout Rules
Reply #11 - Oct 22nd, 2008 at 8:43am
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Thanks Stoyan, that fits exactly with what we are after from the layout Smiley
With regards to 'Groups', can I just clarify I have understood this correctly? Does this mean (my words):

A collection of nodes connected by links with logic id's matching that set for the flowLayoutRules.NodeRules.MainConnectorId property, and where the start node is defined by a node with a logicid added to the flowLayoutRules.NodeRules.GroupStartNodes array and an end node with a logic id that appears in the flowLayoutRules.NodeRules.GroupEndNodes array?

If I have this right then the actual name "ControlFlow" used in the ProcessLayout example is irrelevant except that both the links' logic ids and the flowLayoutRules.NodeRules.MainConnectorId must use the same name for this connector?

(the same goes for all the node logic id names I think?)

I take it that if the above is correct then branching control flow would be a bad idea (better to use a connector with a different logic id)?

Or is a group something else altogether?
  
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Stoyo
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Re: Layout Rules
Reply #12 - Oct 22nd, 2008 at 12:16pm
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Yes, I believe you are right on all points Smiley

Stoyan
  
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jonsberndt
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Re: Layout Rules
Reply #13 - Oct 23rd, 2008 at 3:20am
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I just want to auto-arrange a diagram to look like this:

http://home.comcast.net/~jonsberndt/Photos/ControlSystem.png

Jon
  
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Stoyo
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Re: Layout Rules
Reply #14 - Oct 23rd, 2008 at 7:02am
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This looks close to what LayeredLayout would do. We'll check if it's possible to fix what nodes go in the first and last layers, so you can assign the In nodes to the first layer and the Out to the last one.

Stoyan
  
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